Well, I’m not going to be able to address it well here, but it has be a question that has plagued the church and was addressed in the epistles written by the apostles.

Some more recent authors that have hit on those things, should you be interested in getting a sound, logical, intellectually stimulating response would be:

C.S. Lewis: Mere Christianity

Francis Schaeffer: How Should We Then Live.

I can’t do better than these gentlemen. Have a great day!

That doesn’t mean that I don’t respect your arguments, your beliefs seem completely sound given your worldview. That’s why I tried to direct the conversation toward areas we could discuss outside those core beliefs (and you never answered those questions).

One final point for you, should you return to the discussion: In regards to your perfect faith in the perfect word of your perfect god, does it trouble you at all to know that so many people have interpreted these words in so many different ways? You don’t like to be considered extremist, but certainly you can see that there are a lot of other Christians who have their own understanding of what the Bible is calling them to do and not do. Right? There are Christians who are untroubled by abortion and homosexuality, there are Christians who think the Pope went straight to hell and that America is soon to follow. If your self assurance is derived from the perfect word of god, what makes you so sure that your interpretation happens to be the one that gets it all right, all the time?

Yes, the Witherspoon School of Law and Public Policy is something that has been on my list of go-to’s. Possibly next year, and I’ll be sure to blog about it. If I agree OR disagree. After all I’d probably be the first CANADIAN to go there!

And Jason, feel free to continue.

Jason, open-mindedness and wishy-washy are both the same to me. But are you open minded? You don’t seem that way with my arguments. You seem so ready to put me on the “fringe” that your open mindedness closed to some time ago. By the way, if you can refute my arguments your only recourse is, and has been, various sorts of mockery or discredible associations. You are so sad for me and my children (or at least for my children). Really? You think how “funny” things I mention are. I don’t think like you so I’m on the fringe…is that bad? Why? Does fringe element, “outlier” make me incapable of sound argument? How’s that? In reality we have a disagreement, but the only way I have seen you validate your position is to place me “so far out of the mainstream” (by you definition, whatever that is). It is easier for you I’m sure if I agree with you first before the debate, but then, why debate? Sounds like your open mindedness extents toward that which you already decided was ok for you.

I do need to clarify something though where you may have misunderstood me, or I didn’t make myself as clear as I should have. My assuredness in what I believe and why is based on my understanding of the scriptures (the Bible). Inspired by the omniscient God it is perfectly relevant in every situation. I will agree to be corrected if you can show me by sound biblical exegesis my error. That is really the only factor.

As far as the corpse remarks (David)...that reference comes from Paul to the Ephesians (chpt 2:1-10) where we are dead in sin. I see it as “Lazarus dead”. The kind of dead that didn’t allow Lazarus to debate whether or not he was going to remain in the tomb prior to Jesus’ command “Come forth!” I believe that, though still working through humanistic rationalism, Christians espousing an Arminian view are saved by grace, I just don’t believe that it was the Arminians choice to begin with, and Arminians think they had a hand in their salvation. But as you mentioned earlier, that is in an area different from the original intent of the interview and so I will leave that alone from this point on.

At this point I need to wrap up. Take care of family business, ie, yard sale. Jason, it has been a pleasure, God bless you! You may have the last word (Aside from David of course since this is his blog)

David, I am very impressed with what you are doing here and I pray for the very best for you. In an earlier post you mention Vision Forum. I recommend that at some point, whatever your career pursuits, you take the time to attend their Witherspoon School of Law and Public policy. Imagine being surrounded by young men your age and intellect, some with their fathers, listening to some of the greates Christian thinkers. Check them out at www.visionforum.org Blessings to all.

First this debate seems to have taken a curve away from the actual post, which is totally fine. But it definitely opens our thoughts to a new area, Oneway Purpose did not address this in the interview, and does not necessarily totally support the interviewee in all other areas.

So let me answer a few questions. Let me divide here faith and the mind. For example, I know that Bill and I have some very intense disagreements. For example, on the subject of the sovereignty of God. I debated this issue with my readers a few months back. Here is Calvinism: Part 1 | Calvinism: Part 2 | Calvinism: Part 3. I’m sure you can quickly see that I’m no drone. I believe somewhat differently than my family on various subjects too. We’re all trained various things as children, but as we grow older, there’s a time where we have to reason it out in our minds and decide for ourselves. Otherwise, yes, it is simply your parents understanding. In my profile, I said, I’m ready to challenge, or be challenged. Why? Because challenge is the way to progress. Listen to my podcast on this.

Now, there’s a good point in training your children to defend what they believe. Why? Because that is teaching the ‘whys’, and not all the ‘whats’. ‘Whats’ only work until your about 12 or 13, then the parents had better have taught the ‘whys’. Why? Because the child will start thinking, and asking himself his own questions, and answering them. And I believe this is what Bill is dealing with here. I doesn’t matter to me at all that Bill has the truth. I admire him for that ability. But let’s not mix faith and reason too much here or otherwise it can get trouble. If you base your reason on faith, you can get into trouble. Certain things like salvation, regeneration, etc are based on faith. These in fact have little to do with the reason. Yes, there is the knowledge of God. But that, the Bible says, a little child can understand. Trying to understand all the various things about God, gets a lot deeper. For me, I’m still somewhat undecided on all those issues, still studying, still learning. That is being intellectually honest.

Let me quote myself here, in the last Calvinism debate I concluded by saying. “What I know, I know, and that I defend. What I know not, I know not, and that I seek to learn. And maybe someday what I ‘know not’ will put what I know into a different place.” That will always be my standard, I’m not saying that I don’t have anything to learn. But for that that I do know, I shall defend it. And don’t ask me to tell you it’s my opinion either.

You see, I think I admire Bill, and then I have some questions for him. I admire him because of his willingness to stand up for what he believes. But the question I have to ask him is this. Is the ‘you’re false, I’m right, because I believe I’m right 100%’ a satisfactory comeback? In comment number 12 you inferred that jason was a corpse (a non-regenerate believer), would you be willing to back that up if you found your differences stopped at the intellectual level? Am I a corpse because I believe differently? I appreciate that you don’t have any doubts about what you believe. Neither do I—on the things I am sure of. But is saying you are sure of your intellectual strengths on the basis of faith satisfactory?

Somehow I believe some of these things were said more as a jab. Feel free to correct me, or explain yourself.

But now that I have addressed the issue of intellect, I will be posting, and for my readers attempting to destroy some of the other opinions you have expressed on homeschooling. Not by the assertion of my correctness, but the presentation of reason. Of which I believe we all have PLENTY! I’ll make sure mine is biblical though, then I’ll have a sword too. Right!?

I have trouble believing that you are an educator at all. You are dismissive of my every thought because of its source—shouldn’t an educator know that every person, no matter how small or dim, has something to teach us? Shouldn’t Christian modesty demand that attitude?

Our conversation proves one thing beyond doubt: David didn’t find in you an average public school principal who has come to see the errors in the public education system. Instead, he found a fringe element, an outlier. You don’t represent a larger group, you represent the extreme edge of a spectrum of thought. He found in you someone who apparently joined a system he knew he could never uphold, someone who’s viewpoint is so far outside the mainstream that he could never faithfully serve the mainstream.

What did you expect to contribute to the system, Bill?

As far as my double accusation on your double standard, well, remembering that we’re being “intellectually honest” now and you’re not sure that your answers are the truth, my point persists by your own admission. As far as doubts in my mind about truth, there aren’t any. Not even a tiny speck, no matter how much you don’t want to believe me, it’s not there. You can jump up and down all night and accuse me of someday seeing it your way, but that statement in itself screams of your hope of being right, over my assurance by faith in Christ. Why? I have to take you to the gospel of Jesus Christ. That I was born in sin, I was dead in sin. Like a stinking rotting worm infested dead. You too. And everyone else. The wages of sin is death; we are dead in our sins, but I was made alive in Christ, not by my own works, intellect, good looks, etc, but by grace I was saved. I recommend you read from your Bible Ephesians chpt. 2. It will explain the confidence I have (no, confidence of being 100% certain is different than arrogance because it is based on a humble blessed assurance)

You keep worrying about my sad life and sad goal with my children. Sorry, but have you ever accepted pity from a corpse? That’s how I feel about your statements. You don’t see your own deadness…and frankly you won’t unless by God’s grace He shows it to you if He has chosen you to spare you from the judgement to come.

I know these words may be anethema to you, but the Bible makes it plain that the words of the cross are foolishness to those who are perishing. The cross though is the central figure and symbol of the finished work of God incarnate to fully satisfy the wrath of God on us in our sin. Jesus, God incarnate, took apon himself the sins of the world that we, through Him, might be saved. His resurrection from the dead sealed the salvation for those who believe because He had victory over both sin and death.

Finally, the humor you saw in my comparison using the signers of the declaration exists because of your own ignorance of American History. Whether or not Jefferson or Franklin personally believed in the deity of Christ, they certainly knew the doctrince of the incarnation and substitutional attonement of Christ. John Witherspoon, one of the signers, personally taught 9 of signers, including John Adams, at Princeton. His faith was clearly demonstrated in his writings, as was the faith of most, but that’s another topic. Your reference though to these “men whose beliefs were branded on them by their self-righteous fathers” I think was a bit of a slam directed my way. I could be wrong, but for someone who is “not sure my answers are truth”, thems purdy strong words